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with other, surrounding businesses and city governments, and 4) by <br />reducing the benefits, morale and productivity woul'd be damaged. <br />Mr. Harding suggested that if a change had to be made, that it be made <br />for new employees only. In addition, he recommended putting a cap <br />on the benefits to avoid paying someone more after .retirement than <br />before. <br /> <br /> Mr. Mannie Norford, City Sheriff, asked that his deputies be <br /> included in the ordinance in order for them to qualify for City retire- <br /> ment benefits. Mr. Norford added that he concurred with Mr. Harding's <br /> remarks. <br /> <br /> Mr. Julian Taliaferro, Fire Chief, stated that the fire fighters <br /> <br /> were concerned that in comparison with other localities the City's <br /> retirement plan was in the middle, but if the benefits were reduced, <br /> the City would fall in the lowe~ portion of the state. Mr. Taliaferro <br /> said he preferred to see the current formula with a cap and the new <br /> formula be applied only to new employees. He added that he supported <br /> the post-retirement supplement for fire fighters and p~tice. <br /> <br /> Mr. John deKoven Bowen, Chief of Police, stated that he supported <br /> <br /> all of the recommendations except the change in the.formula. He said <br /> he felt the best approach would be to have a cap used with the ~resent <br /> formula. <br /> <br /> Mr. Ed Bain spoke on behalf of the Fire and Police Associations, and <br /> asked Council to look seriously at the figures and at how employees <br /> would be realistically affected if a new formUla were to be adopted. <br /> <br /> Mr. David ToScano, a citizen, questioned why the system was thought <br /> of as too rich. He stated that the nature of pensions had been that <br /> employees chose to forego present wages in favor of future benefits. <br /> <br /> Mr. Buck staged that public employees earn competitive wages and the <br /> retirement plan was not compensation for unfair wages. <br /> <br /> Mr. gob Cudrow, a fire fighter, stated that he had been given the <br /> City's commitment for the current pension plan when he was hired and <br /> favored a cap instead of a change. <br /> <br /> Mr. Conover stated that in 1982 the City had had to let 49 employees <br /> go because their positions could no longer be funded, and that changes <br /> were sometimes necessary regardless of commitments previously made. <br /> <br /> Mr. David Cole, a fire fighter, asked Council if the change in <br /> benefits made in 1976 was mandated by law. <br /> <br /> Mr. Buck ~eplied that the City was mandated to pay at least two- <br /> thirds of what the Virginia State Retirement System paid in benefits. <br /> <br /> As there were no further comments from the public, the public hearing <br /> was closed. <br /> <br /> Mr. Buck stressed that if a change in the formula was made, all <br /> years earned to date would be'figured under the old formula. <br /> <br /> Mrs. Gleason asked that figures be provided to Council on how a <br /> change in the formula would effect present employees' benefits.. <br /> <br /> Mr. Conover stated that he did not feel he had enough information <br /> <br /> to vote on a change in the ordinance. He said he felt that putting a <br /> cap on the system would encourage employees to retire early. Mr. Conover <br /> further commented that he felt the City was committed to being a respon- <br /> <br /> <br />